Episode 6

full
Published on:

11th Sep 2026

Let's Get Spicy!

What do mint, radish, and burnt plastic have in common? How do you explain a physical sensation to somebody without a shared language or experience to fall back on? How did the arrival of chile pepper from the Americas change the meaning of "spicy" in the old world? Does it make sense to refer to a smell or a physical sensation of Qi movement as "flavor"? Is the lung special?

So many questions, and so many possible answers that only lead to more questions! Argh.... once again, we invite you to join us as we explore a translation conundrum that has been bothering us quite a bit lately: how do we understand and describe, or even translate, the flavor xīn 辛, associated with the lung and metal among the five dynamic agents. The conversation moves beyond dictionary definitions into lived experience, sensory language, and the body’s felt response to taste, aroma, and the movement of Qi.

We play with the terms acrid, pungent, spicy, and aromatic, but ultimately reject each one. Along the way, we examine how herbs and foods associated with this flavor, like garlic, mint, radish, cinnamon, and cardamom, fit into the picture and what they have in common.

The discussion also widens into culture and food systems: why chili peppers became central in regions like Sichuan, Hunan, Vietnam, Thailand, and India; how climate, scarcity, and preservation shaped culinary traditions; and how soup, fermentation, and spice function as both nourishment and medicine.

Ultimately, we determine that the concept of wèi 味 covers not just flavor (its usual translation), but taste, smell, and the deeper bodily response in the movement of Qi that Chinese medicine tracks through the lens of the "Five Flavors" or wǔwèi 五味, as experienced when a substance comes into contact with the tongue, the nose, or the throat.

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About the Podcast

A Pebble in the Cosmic Pond
Old and New Stories from China's Healing Traditions
Tune in every New Moon for inspiring, joyful, and informative conversations with Sabine Wilms and Leo Lok on transforming ourselves, our communities, and the world, in the spirit of traditional Chinese medicine, spirituality, and philosophy. Separating fact from fiction, we aim to bring you medicine from China's distant past, translated here to meet YOUR needs today, in your personal practice, in your community, and in the clinic.

Sabine Wilms, PhD, is a medical historian, recovering university professor, and author and translator of more than a dozen books on the Chinese healing arts, from gynecology and pediatrics to medical ethics and materia medica, published by Happy Goat Productions. In addition to writing, she runs the only advanced 2-year classical Chinese training program for practitioners of Chinese medicine and contributes insights from her checkered past as a biodynamic goat farmer and musician, all under the banner of her favorite phrase, “cosmic resonance,” a.k.a. the Chinese ideal of harmony between the three realms of Heaven, Earth, and Humanity. Leo Lok, our "purveyor of multiple perspectives," is a practitioner and independent scholar of Chinese Medicine. A native speaker/reader of Chinese languages, Leo is one of the rare clinician-scholars in the world who excels in researching and translating ancient Chinese medical literature into the English language.

Together, we offer courses on the Chinese healing arts and run the "Frolicking Fish Community" to provide deep, sustained engagement with our work and play. In a lovingly curated themed collection, we present you each month with the introductory "moongate," original translations, creative expressions, and audio and video recordings on the Chinese healing arts, culture and history, food and art, philosophy and religion, Qi cultivation, and more. In addition, the community forum offers connection, education, and inspiration.

We both love to inspire people and spread around some healing and loving vibrations. Here are our three main goals:
1. Bridge-building: We gather to explore the liminal sweet spot, in between Heaven and Earth, the distant past and the present moment, East and West, the clinic and the academy, the healer and the scholar, the discernible and the unfathomable, oral lineage and written text, and, ultimately, Yin and Yang.
2. Collaboration: The treasure house of traditional Chinese medicine is bigger than any single person's expertise, no matter how vast. We actively pursue and embrace a diversity of opinions so that we can collectively deepen our understanding. We always aim to approach our disagreements with curiosity and mutual respect, instead of defensiveness.
3. Authentic Transmission: Translation, from the past to the present, from Chinese to English, from texts to clinical application, etc., invariably involves an alteration and adaptation of the original message. How do we stay true to the wisdom and spirit of the ancient Chinese texts while still making sense to our modern English-speaking listeners? We invite you to consider the creative challenges of this task with us.

In addition to subscribing to this podcast, we invite you to sign up for our newsletter (at Happygoatproductions.com/connect), where we share resources like free articles, announcements of new courses or publications, updates on our work and life, little glimpses of love and joy and beauty, and occasionally Sabine's poetry and farm pictures.
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About your host

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Sabine Wilms

I am the producer, manager, director, and (whether I like it or not) person in charge of this podcast. I take full responsibility for this project and vision but do not necessarily agree with anything anybody else says on my podcast, whether it is framed as an opinion or a fact. You can find out more about my books at happygoatproductions.com, my mentoring at imperialtutor.com, my classical Chinese offerings at translatingchinesemedicine.com, and my gynecology courses at traditionalChinesegynecology.com.